Konrad Val`Dismouth (Feb 14, 2011 5:59:16 PM)
(This user has entered Discussion) (IP = 75.32.114.125)

Janelle Timberland (Feb 14, 2011 5:59:20 PM)
(This user has entered Discussion) (IP = 24.215.89.31)

Janelle Timberland (Feb 14, 2011 5:59:48 PM)
So if I kick, and you block and take a rage action. And for your rage you attack, I cannot defend.

Konrad Val`Dismouth (Feb 14, 2011 6:00:21 PM)
right

Janelle Timberland (Feb 14, 2011 6:00:47 PM)
So that's the best option always!

Konrad Val`Dismouth (Feb 14, 2011 6:01:04 PM)
if you dont have an action you can't defend against attacks

Janelle Timberland (Feb 14, 2011 6:01:43 PM)
You're missing the twickery.

Konrad Val`Dismouth (Feb 14, 2011 6:01:53 PM)
You declare kick

Konrad Val`Dismouth (Feb 14, 2011 6:01:58 PM)
i declare kick rage

Konrad Val`Dismouth (Feb 14, 2011 6:02:00 PM)
you kick

Konrad Val`Dismouth (Feb 14, 2011 6:02:02 PM)
i kick

Konrad Val`Dismouth (Feb 14, 2011 6:02:05 PM)
then i punch

Konrad Val`Dismouth (Feb 14, 2011 6:02:07 PM)
you cant block

Janelle Timberland (Feb 14, 2011 6:02:28 PM)
But there is no way to convert the kick to a block, because it's against rage.

Konrad Val`Dismouth (Feb 14, 2011 6:02:34 PM)
No

Konrad Val`Dismouth (Feb 14, 2011 6:02:39 PM)
If you revert to block

Konrad Val`Dismouth (Feb 14, 2011 6:02:44 PM)
you block the first thing coming at you

Konrad Val`Dismouth (Feb 14, 2011 6:02:54 PM)
either way in that scenario an attack is getting through

Janelle Timberland (Feb 14, 2011 6:03:22 PM)
So imagine I kick five times, and you dodge five times and spend one rage. I can't defend against that one rage.

Konrad Val`Dismouth (Feb 14, 2011 6:03:54 PM)
Right

Konrad Val`Dismouth (Feb 14, 2011 6:04:00 PM)
because by the time rage actions come up

Janelle Timberland (Feb 14, 2011 6:04:04 PM)
It's unblockable, and the kicks are unconvertable.

Konrad Val`Dismouth (Feb 14, 2011 6:04:08 PM)
no

Konrad Val`Dismouth (Feb 14, 2011 6:04:20 PM)
You can choose to revert an action to a defensive action if you want

Janelle Timberland (Feb 14, 2011 6:04:28 PM)
Against the rage?

Konrad Val`Dismouth (Feb 14, 2011 6:04:39 PM)
a block goes against the first attack taken

Konrad Val`Dismouth (Feb 14, 2011 6:04:48 PM)
As it goes first action

Konrad Val`Dismouth (Feb 14, 2011 6:04:51 PM)
Kick/Block

Konrad Val`Dismouth (Feb 14, 2011 6:05:10 PM)
Second action Ill revert to a defensive action opponent has no offensive action is held , next split

Janelle Timberland (Feb 14, 2011 6:05:16 PM)
The kicks are already rolled when the rage takes place. Are you saying I can convert a kick then?

Konrad Val`Dismouth (Feb 14, 2011 6:05:18 PM)
so you can revert your second kick into a block

Konrad Val`Dismouth (Feb 14, 2011 6:05:31 PM)
No you can not revert a kick thats already been taken

Konrad Val`Dismouth (Feb 14, 2011 6:05:37 PM)
But

Konrad Val`Dismouth (Feb 14, 2011 6:05:45 PM)
If you go main kick - okay ill kick still

Konrad Val`Dismouth (Feb 14, 2011 6:05:58 PM)
second split - Ill revert this to block - third split ill continue kick

Konrad Val`Dismouth (Feb 14, 2011 6:06:10 PM)
Then your rage comes in, i have my second split action to block

Janelle Timberland (Feb 14, 2011 6:06:25 PM)
So you do this because you see that he declared rage.

Konrad Val`Dismouth (Feb 14, 2011 6:06:41 PM)
well

Konrad Val`Dismouth (Feb 14, 2011 6:06:47 PM)
If you win iniative you can

Konrad Val`Dismouth (Feb 14, 2011 6:07:08 PM)
But if you won iniative why would you declare all these attacks and not prepare defense against the rage

Janelle Timberland (Feb 14, 2011 6:07:13 PM)
If you don't win initiative, you can still convert to a block for the rage, can't you?

Konrad Val`Dismouth (Feb 14, 2011 6:07:18 PM)
yes

Janelle Timberland (Feb 14, 2011 6:07:21 PM)
So...

Konrad Val`Dismouth (Feb 14, 2011 6:07:28 PM)
lets keep it simple

Konrad Val`Dismouth (Feb 14, 2011 6:07:36 PM)
Jan rolls iniative 12 b 6 i roll 13 b 7

Konrad Val`Dismouth (Feb 14, 2011 6:07:44 PM)
You declare kick split for a second kick

Konrad Val`Dismouth (Feb 14, 2011 6:07:54 PM)
I declare, Punch Rage action

Konrad Val`Dismouth (Feb 14, 2011 6:08:01 PM)
I take my first action Punch

Janelle Timberland (Feb 14, 2011 6:08:10 PM)
I convert a kick to a dodge because I see you have a rage.

Konrad Val`Dismouth (Feb 14, 2011 6:08:13 PM)
Here you can choose revert your first aciton to block or let it go through

Konrad Val`Dismouth (Feb 14, 2011 6:08:25 PM)
Just let me finish

Konrad Val`Dismouth (Feb 14, 2011 6:08:30 PM)
You choose to let it go

Konrad Val`Dismouth (Feb 14, 2011 6:08:40 PM)
I hit you for blank damage you soak blank

Konrad Val`Dismouth (Feb 14, 2011 6:08:58 PM)
your second action kick is now up, you can revert this action with out kicking or using it to attack into a block

Konrad Val`Dismouth (Feb 14, 2011 6:09:08 PM)
after you do it goes back to me for my rage i now swing you can now block

Janelle Timberland (Feb 14, 2011 6:09:45 PM)
So you're repeating what I just said. If I see you have a rage action lined up, I should have the same number of dodges or blocks lined up, always.

Konrad Val`Dismouth (Feb 14, 2011 6:10:15 PM)
Right, the advantage of winning iniative, you can set up to be offensive or defensive

Konrad Val`Dismouth (Feb 14, 2011 6:10:31 PM)
other then that your original question if they use all actions to attack they cant block the rage

Janelle Timberland (Feb 14, 2011 6:11:02 PM)
But even the loser can convert offensive to defensive, right? So it doesn't matter. Might as well always declare all offensive, then convert whatever you need to defensive.

Konrad Val`Dismouth (Feb 14, 2011 6:11:15 PM)
In WtA you can do that

Janelle Timberland (Feb 14, 2011 6:11:38 PM)
In the others you just roll willpower, and everyone has lots of willpower.

Konrad Val`Dismouth (Feb 14, 2011 6:11:52 PM)
*shrugs* i dont know i dont play other games

Janelle Timberland (Feb 14, 2011 6:12:01 PM)
I do, and them's the rules.

Konrad Val`Dismouth (Feb 14, 2011 6:12:26 PM)
And you can even convert defensive declares to offensive with a wp roll and the action goes to +1 Diff

Janelle Timberland (Feb 14, 2011 6:12:32 PM)
So, in summary, take as many actions as possible, always, everytime, and always go full offensive if you lose initiative.

Janelle Timberland (Feb 14, 2011 6:12:59 PM)
Wait, you can convert to offensive? That's broken.

Janelle Timberland (Feb 14, 2011 6:13:53 PM)
So person A declares a kick and dodge. Person B declares a single dodge. Person A changes his dodge to a kick as well. Person B has no actions to respond.

Konrad Val`Dismouth (Feb 14, 2011 6:14:16 PM)
right

Janelle Timberland (Feb 14, 2011 6:14:25 PM)
Once again, always take as many actions as you possible can, it seems.

Konrad Val`Dismouth (Feb 14, 2011 6:14:36 PM)
Just know in wta if you take actions over either dex or witts all actionsa re at +3 diff

Konrad Val`Dismouth (Feb 14, 2011 6:14:52 PM)
and you dont want to take as many actions as possible

Konrad Val`Dismouth (Feb 14, 2011 6:15:03 PM)
because if you are splitting actions each attack is ad - dice

Janelle Timberland (Feb 14, 2011 6:15:19 PM)
If what you're telling me is true, you kinda do, otherwise you're getting hit no matter what.

Konrad Val`Dismouth (Feb 14, 2011 6:15:39 PM)
Have you had combat yet?

Janelle Timberland (Feb 14, 2011 6:16:26 PM)
Yep, but the system is broken with these extra rules. I saw them used once and I was like, "WTF WTA IS FUKD...."

Konrad Val`Dismouth (Feb 14, 2011 6:16:36 PM)
Its all in the core

Konrad Val`Dismouth (Feb 14, 2011 6:16:41 PM)
there are no extra rules

Janelle Timberland (Feb 14, 2011 6:17:00 PM)
"extra" as in rarely used in casual play.

Konrad Val`Dismouth (Feb 14, 2011 6:17:07 PM)
If you're a starting character not built to break combat typicaly you are limited to 3 actions tops at low dice

Konrad Val`Dismouth (Feb 14, 2011 6:17:19 PM)
because if you take more actions its allllll at +3 diff

Janelle Timberland (Feb 14, 2011 6:17:47 PM)
I have two actions, tops, right now. But the moment I get a third it's always to my advantage to use it, if what you say is true.

Konrad Val`Dismouth (Feb 14, 2011 6:18:38 PM)
Not really if you have..lets say Dex 4 melee 3

Konrad Val`Dismouth (Feb 14, 2011 6:18:44 PM)
so 7 dice to stab people

Konrad Val`Dismouth (Feb 14, 2011 6:19:00 PM)
It might just be better to roll one attack with 7 dice instead of taking one at 5 and another at 4

Janelle Timberland (Feb 14, 2011 6:19:14 PM)
Except you can't rage then.

Janelle Timberland (Feb 14, 2011 6:19:19 PM)
I mean, dodge rage then.

Konrad Val`Dismouth (Feb 14, 2011 6:19:35 PM)
well depends if you win iniative be on the offense

Konrad Val`Dismouth (Feb 14, 2011 6:19:40 PM)
make your opponent be defensive

Konrad Val`Dismouth (Feb 14, 2011 6:20:15 PM)
So, Take two mains and a rage action

Konrad Val`Dismouth (Feb 14, 2011 6:20:20 PM)
Bite/Bite Rage Bite

Konrad Val`Dismouth (Feb 14, 2011 6:20:29 PM)
your opponent will have declared

Konrad Val`Dismouth (Feb 14, 2011 6:20:36 PM)
be responsive to your opponent

Janelle Timberland (Feb 14, 2011 6:20:46 PM)
Okay, I understand the system. Here's a fun question: How do people know that the other is taking a rage action, RP-wise?

Konrad Val`Dismouth (Feb 14, 2011 6:21:22 PM)
RP wise you wont know untill some one uses a descriptor like "And in a blur of action the claw slashed down at you catching you unaware or unprepared"

Janelle Timberland (Feb 14, 2011 6:21:46 PM)
How do werewolves know that the other is using a rage action?

Konrad Val`Dismouth (Feb 14, 2011 6:21:50 PM)
Just, think like some one is swinging as fast as they can with their fist, then for a split second they threw two punches in the time it takes to throe one

Konrad Val`Dismouth (Feb 14, 2011 6:22:08 PM)
They move quicker, and in anger

Janelle Timberland (Feb 14, 2011 6:22:29 PM)
... question missed.

Konrad Val`Dismouth (Feb 14, 2011 6:22:39 PM)
How do werewolves know that the other is using a rage aciton

Konrad Val`Dismouth (Feb 14, 2011 6:23:07 PM)
System based, when an action is declared, the person that won iniative can 'tell' what the other is doing

Janelle Timberland (Feb 14, 2011 6:23:13 PM)
In the original turn, yep, so they know to save a dodge.

Konrad Val`Dismouth (Feb 14, 2011 6:23:20 PM)
giving them the ability to act faster

Konrad Val`Dismouth (Feb 14, 2011 6:23:30 PM)
now for flavor combat isnt ment for flavor

Konrad Val`Dismouth (Feb 14, 2011 6:23:37 PM)
its ment to kill your opponent

Janelle Timberland (Feb 14, 2011 6:24:20 PM)
... so you're saying that the system doesn't at all reflect what's actually happening?

Konrad Val`Dismouth (Feb 14, 2011 6:24:36 PM)
Sure it dose

Konrad Val`Dismouth (Feb 14, 2011 6:25:11 PM)
If i claw your three times i claw you three times

Janelle Timberland (Feb 14, 2011 6:25:16 PM)
So in that initiial round before the rage action, how does the other know that they're taking the rage action.

Konrad Val`Dismouth (Feb 14, 2011 6:25:39 PM)
Mechanically you could make an empathy check if you won iniative

Konrad Val`Dismouth (Feb 14, 2011 6:25:55 PM)
Other then that you react before your oponent acts

Janelle Timberland (Feb 14, 2011 6:26:01 PM)
So we have to make an empathy check to know? No one does that.

Konrad Val`Dismouth (Feb 14, 2011 6:26:08 PM)
no you dont

Konrad Val`Dismouth (Feb 14, 2011 6:26:09 PM)
its like this

Konrad Val`Dismouth (Feb 14, 2011 6:26:59 PM)
*Konrad barrels down at janelle, its obvious with his raised claw that he is going to strike*(Declare claw) *and in the movement of his left it looks like he's going to strike again*(With a split for a second claw)

Janelle Timberland (Feb 14, 2011 6:27:22 PM)
(plus rage)

Konrad Val`Dismouth (Feb 14, 2011 6:27:48 PM)
*Jannel notices the creature and decides its best to get out of the way*(Declare dodge) *and with the aggresion and poise of him it may be just be better to get outa the even better(Splti for a second dodge)

Konrad Val`Dismouth (Feb 14, 2011 6:28:21 PM)
And if you're going to use rage you can do something like

Konrad Val`Dismouth (Feb 14, 2011 6:28:38 PM)
*And his form looks ready to spring again with another flury of action*(1 rage for an action)

Konrad Val`Dismouth (Feb 14, 2011 6:29:01 PM)
So opponent can tell what will be happening and can react acordingly

Konrad Val`Dismouth (Feb 14, 2011 6:29:51 PM)
like maybe janelle thinks its best to wound the beast before he makes his attacks in an attempt to slow him down, so main action stab, but incase that is not enough it may be best to get outa the way, split for a dodge, and hey it looks like it might keep going, split for a third dodge

Janelle Timberland (Feb 14, 2011 6:30:13 PM)
So rage is "Hey it looks like he might keep going?"

Konrad Val`Dismouth (Feb 14, 2011 6:30:58 PM)
or hey its being really agressive

Konrad Val`Dismouth (Feb 14, 2011 6:31:02 PM)
*Shrugs*

Janelle Timberland (Feb 14, 2011 6:31:02 PM)
I think I might need to ask the STs about it, because I think you're just thinking aloud here. It doesn't quite make sense.

Konrad Val`Dismouth (Feb 14, 2011 6:31:26 PM)
You win iniative you know what your opponent is doing

Janelle Timberland (Feb 14, 2011 6:31:35 PM)
Because if that were the case, you wouldn't know until after his initial actions that he's "still ready for more."

Janelle Timberland (Feb 14, 2011 6:32:12 PM)
Therefore, there must be some 'tell' for how many actions are coming up.

Konrad Val`Dismouth (Feb 14, 2011 6:32:49 PM)
It's just, combat and flavor

Konrad Val`Dismouth (Feb 14, 2011 6:33:04 PM)
Its up to you and sts and other pc's

Janelle Timberland (Feb 14, 2011 6:33:13 PM)
i.e., it's just the system, and we twick the description to match the system.

Konrad Val`Dismouth (Feb 14, 2011 6:33:38 PM)
yeah

Janelle Timberland (Feb 14, 2011 6:33:57 PM)
Okay.

Janelle Timberland (Feb 14, 2011 6:34:08 PM)
I learned a lot here. Thanks.

Janelle Timberland (Feb 14, 2011 6:34:19 PM)
(This user has moved to OOC Room) (IP = 24.215.89.31)

Konrad Val`Dismouth (Feb 14, 2011 6:36:25 PM)
(This user has moved to OOC Room) (IP = 75.32.114.125)