Tohunga (Sep 18, 2010 8:40:21 PM)
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auggy (Sep 18, 2010 8:41:23 PM)
Okay, what's on your mind?
Tohunga (Sep 18, 2010 8:42:22 PM)
writing it up >.>
Tohunga (Sep 18, 2010 8:44:10 PM)
Okay man, this is largely over Irene ... I'm not sure how to deal with it and basically i'm at a loss how we do. SO .... numina is to be all approved by the mage team, Irene was made while a player with a focus on her being weird and always looking to get more spiritually involved and weird with time. This became more evident when the shl's went to germany and the scene I was given involved an npc saying "okay, i'll do it for you, talk to the spirits." Then I was told, "we're not rping that out, you can BB it and whatever happens after it and ask for permission for numina increases". I then talked to ghostlin who said that due to my mage team situation that I just talk to my boss for approval...
Tohunga (Sep 18, 2010 8:45:52 PM)
now, Irene currently has nothing on her sheet that isn't in a wta book. I was intending to take a dot from sorcerer, but its not worth it honestly given all of the above. I've been told basically that 1) i won't get scenes regarding it 2) I go to the mage team (ie. my boss) for what should in the end be rediculous cause why would she ever say no to me?
auggy (Sep 18, 2010 8:45:57 PM)
Okay. Snowcrane not responding, or something completely different?
Tohunga (Sep 18, 2010 8:47:44 PM)
no, the issue is that the decision makes Irene basically unplayable. This compiled with the decision incorporating jayded's kin sorcerer and the other couple means that as a mage team we have to approve powers to kinfolk without any real knowledge of the pc's actions or how it might affect the venue they're in. Say I suddenly approved hellfire to one and he goes about and does shit with it ... all of a sudden the venue teams would be at a head with each other.
Tohunga (Sep 18, 2010 8:48:10 PM)
thats an extreme example
auggy (Sep 18, 2010 8:48:55 PM)
Understandable. Now, I'm not sure if I ever asked you this, but. What do you see Irene becoming?
Tohunga (Sep 18, 2010 8:48:57 PM)
I know "special kin" are capped now, but why were they ever approved if the team then went and made a collective decision to not run anything for them? It just makes no sense
Tohunga (Sep 18, 2010 8:51:47 PM)
Irene? At best I see her having a few dots of the shapeshifting numina and spirit chaser numina, both based around bat only. I see her being more invested with the spiritual world and in time learning more about it. Many kinfolk canonically are very spiritual, some much more than garou - more than anything I don't want her to just be another kin to fuck and deal with kinfolk "whos with who" dramas. With that side of her placed in BBs and with it coming down to "you BB it and we give it a stamp", allthe control comes into my hand as she advances with next to nothing out of my control. Thats no fun, part of being a player is to have things taken out of your control.
Tohunga (Sep 18, 2010 8:52:45 PM)
largely the issue here is that its disinfranchised me with even wanting to play in wta and with it being the largest venue the "best bet" for getting any personal rp of my own while i'm not an ST. If I don't sort it out ... I could burn myself out. I don't want that.
auggy (Sep 18, 2010 8:55:54 PM)
Right. Here's my side of it, and I'm sure you can appreciate this to a degree. Player to ST ratio right now in all the games is not where I want it to be. I don't want to take power out of anyones' hands, but at the same time, and I hate saying this, not everyone can get the ST facetime they truly deserve.
auggy (Sep 18, 2010 8:56:04 PM)
But...I'm coming up with a plan.
auggy (Sep 18, 2010 8:56:23 PM)
And this is on the fly, and I'm like...writing it as I think of it.
Tohunga (Sep 18, 2010 8:57:21 PM)
its not just the st facetime ... its just that i've been told it'll basically never happen. Thats not cool. Combine that with the ludicrousness of going to my boss to ask for dots for a venue outside of our own? How is she never going to be biased by me being on the mage team with her? How could she ever say "no"?
Tohunga (Sep 18, 2010 8:58:46 PM)
Its gotten to the point that deletion of irene has felt like the best way to deal with it. One less thorn in the side for wta over a decision to let numina kinfolk exist when they don't appear to have really wanted them in the first place ... and one less issue for me.
Tohunga (Sep 18, 2010 8:59:01 PM)
its just that beyond that i have no idea what i'd make to replace it.
auggy (Sep 18, 2010 9:00:36 PM)
Indeed.
auggy (Sep 18, 2010 9:00:44 PM)
I'm working on something here.
auggy (Sep 18, 2010 9:01:25 PM)
Okay. the real problem is that Numinaed kin exist, but they're not getting any advancement potential?
auggy (Sep 18, 2010 9:02:57 PM)
Or, it's just a unique staff problem?
Tohunga (Sep 18, 2010 9:03:28 PM)
partly and that putting it in the lap of the mage team could cause issues in the future for anything we do approve. How can we realistically approve powers to these kinfolk without full knowledge over the effects approving these could have - even excluding Irene. Shes not the only one. I've been told several times how much of a shitstorm Gretchen tends to cause drama wise, shes come to me about asking for shapeshifting numina points ....
Tohunga (Sep 18, 2010 9:04:21 PM)
how do i approve that without my knowledge of the drama she is causing and the fact that in their hands it could cause -way- more drama and upset the venue st's (outside of jayded) even more? Causing fraction between teams
auggy (Sep 18, 2010 9:04:51 PM)
Yes, I'm getting into tech support mode of "Asking the probing questions". Really, it seems like it's a matter of authority.
Tohunga (Sep 18, 2010 9:05:31 PM)
I will admit a good amount of this comes at a personal level, but if its effecting me personally as an ST ... then no doubt its going to be effecting the others in time too.
auggy (Sep 18, 2010 9:06:12 PM)
I mean, to reverse the situation, if I were to make a Hermetic with the Shapeshifter kin merit...does that give Ghostlin authority over an Arete increase?
Tohunga (Sep 18, 2010 9:07:24 PM)
well, we wouldn't have it now and no, at this given point in time, it'd be in mages hands. Gretchen and Dmitri were made as pure sorcerers with the kinfolk merit like your above post. There aren't any pure magi with the kinfolk merit (and never will be any)
auggy (Sep 18, 2010 9:08:32 PM)
Yeah. It's honestly a headache. So...here's my proposal. My initial idea was a soluton looking for a problem.
Tohunga (Sep 18, 2010 9:09:10 PM)
Irene was made differently from how gretchen and dmitri were. I made her as a kinfolk and then the merit to have numina. They made them as sorcerers with the merit to be kinfolk. Makes Irene a -LOT- less powerful than the other two.
auggy (Sep 18, 2010 9:09:22 PM)
What I'm thinking is we go to each of the special-one-players, and ask them a simple question; What venue is this a part of.
auggy (Sep 18, 2010 9:10:27 PM)
I mean, by the way things are witten, Gretchen and Dmitri are under the mage umbrella, and Irene comes under the werewolf one. Yeah?
Tohunga (Sep 18, 2010 9:10:46 PM)
well i know dmitri hasn't done much of anything with the mta players at all. I haven't seen him lately but hes almost totally been on the sept when he's played. Gretchen has too, but I know shes found a mage mentor in a verbena (though the player has gone for military for a few months.)
Tohunga (Sep 18, 2010 9:11:08 PM)
they both asked to have kinfolk icons rather than mage ones, I think thats indicative of which venue they see themselves under.
auggy (Sep 18, 2010 9:14:10 PM)
True. Which...again, this pretty much seems to lay everything on the Werewolf staff.
auggy (Sep 18, 2010 9:14:33 PM)
Am I wrong in thinking this is their ball?
Tohunga (Sep 18, 2010 9:15:37 PM)
No, not at all. Yet they've made the decision that its ... the mage teams. I was told by Ghostlin when I went to him due to now being on the mage team that I would have to ask Snowcrane for any requests. Let me just go get the transcripts of what i sent her on skype about it, one sec
Tohunga (Sep 18, 2010 9:16:47 PM)
[31/08/10 12:16:29 p.m.] lakantanz: oh. I have to talk to you about one of my pc's too btw...
[31/08/10 12:16:49 p.m.] Rebecca: oh?
[31/08/10 12:19:20 p.m.] lakantanz: Irene Copp, shes a kinfolk with numina. I've asked the wta st's what they're doing with her, and despite being made with kinfolk creation rules rather than sorcerer with kinfolk merit (like the other two were) i've got to go through the mage team with any numina increase for approval. Which means ... they're not running anything ... so i have to do it all under my own steam. And go through you.
[31/08/10 12:20:47 p.m.] Rebecca: I trust you to use your judgment.
[31/08/10 12:20:52 p.m.] Rebecca: just keep me in the loop.
[31/08/10 12:22:22 p.m.] lakantanz: well, she has spirit chaser. which is the kin book, basically you get affinities with a particular type of animal. In Irene's case its Bat. Outside of that I thought low lvl Shapeshifting worked well, focused on bat too.
[31/08/10 12:24:23 p.m.] lakantanz: could you maybe send an f
Tohunga (Sep 18, 2010 9:17:22 PM)
could you maybe send an fpm or skype msg to ghostlin just saying that you give the okay for Irene and Numina increases. I'm hardly going to request heaps and make her crazy powerful. Currently she has all of 1 numina dot. Compared to the normal sorcerer, shes really low powered
[31/08/10 12:24:46 p.m.] Rebecca: that's fine with me. I'll get on that later.
auggy (Sep 18, 2010 9:19:32 PM)
And it's...2 weeks later...
auggy (Sep 18, 2010 9:22:10 PM)
Hrm.Okay, I'm going to pull this and talk to SD about it. Right now, I think I've got enough to talk to people and ask for their logic.
Tohunga (Sep 18, 2010 9:23:10 PM)
indeed. I haven't put in a request but I also haven't heard anything from Ghostlin about. I just ... its honestly stupid? Why should the mage venue police pc's that aren't in the mage venue? Why were these pc's even sanctioned in the first place if the wta team werent going to run things for them?
auggy (Sep 18, 2010 9:25:44 PM)
I can't disagree. So give me a few days to catch people, if you would please?
auggy (Sep 18, 2010 9:26:31 PM)
And play Irene. ;)
Tohunga (Sep 18, 2010 9:29:41 PM)
its hard man. I feel like I've had the carpet pulled out from under my feet with it.
auggy (Sep 18, 2010 9:34:30 PM)
Understandable. But...I'mma try and get this done as quickly as I can.
Tohunga (Sep 18, 2010 9:34:34 PM)
anyway, now you're aware of the situation and partly why i haven't been playing Irene as much lately. Its compounded a little with the (mostly self created) issues with Ash, my garou but thats another story
auggy (Sep 18, 2010 9:34:57 PM)
It is. Also, movie time.
Tohunga (Sep 18, 2010 9:35:59 PM)
alright, i'll leave you be man, thanks for listening.
Tohunga (Sep 18, 2010 9:37:42 PM)
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auggy (Sep 18, 2010 9:45:10 PM)
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