GeoffH OOC (May 16, 2011 10:00:51 PM)
(This user has entered Talk) (IP = 76.123.109.60)
Gabby Girl (May 16, 2011 10:01:15 PM)
I am here
Gabby Girl (May 16, 2011 10:02:04 PM)
I am in green to keep anyone from disturbing me during this conversation.
GeoffH OOC (May 16, 2011 10:04:18 PM)
Cool beans. Don't know if you want to start or me so thought I would preface this by saying, I think this is long overdue and I really want you to keep in mind that I view this as a conversation between two people like over coffee, with smiles. I'm not here to get in a fight with you or grab some grand screen shots for soapbox. Yea?
Gabby Girl (May 16, 2011 10:05:40 PM)
Okay, and yes I would like you to start. I will respond to what it is you post when you have finished posting.
GeoffH OOC (May 16, 2011 10:09:40 PM)
Okay, I lay a lot of blame for what happened at Ghostlin's feet. He had no control over his staff and depending on who you got in a scene with, the rules would change. Before you were even a Narrator, I ran into problem after problem with ST's changing the rules mid scene to the detriment of my character. Then in the next scene another ST would change the rule back. Some things that were done to me were changing the number of actions someone could take without penalty, activated gifts or fetishes that they spent no gnosis and never rolled for, and some grappling shinanigans that I still don't understand. So, when I got to the 'infamous' scene I had been right screwed over several times. My hackles were up, so to speak. (more)
Gabby Girl (May 16, 2011 10:15:17 PM)
.
Gabby Girl (May 16, 2011 10:15:29 PM)
(just making sure I didnt fall off)
GeoffH OOC (May 16, 2011 10:15:48 PM)
Now, I have heard a number of different stories about what really happened in that scene. But, they are always from someone else. I've never heard your real version of what happened. Ghostlin accused me of escalating the scene by arguing with you when I only simply stated a difference of opinion about the rule of sacrificing rage actions. Then came the unannounce Fetish use and it just tipped me over the brink. Since that scene and the subsequent ruling that nothing would change that the scene was going to be delt with as is, it has just deepened the chasm between player and ST. It was as if all of our outcry over the issue was unimportant. Then I came up with the Summoned Spirit compromise. Admittedly, I would still have been pissed if that was pulled the night of. But, at least it would have been transparent that the scene was just a Storyline Track rather than a real challenge.
GeoffH OOC (May 16, 2011 10:16:24 PM)
( more)
GeoffH OOC (May 16, 2011 10:22:10 PM)
But, I set out thinking, okay well I'll give her a chance to redeem herself. I'll play along and try to get involved in her SL. But, then without failing I was completely excluded from the SL all together. You certainly made concessions to make sure Dastai was involved but, me as a player, and one you viewed as a problem, I got shelfed. And honestly, I would not have had a problem with not being in the SL if there was things going on around the Tribe/Sept other than stuff in Maine. It is a chat set in New Orleans after all. But, I could not give you a chance to make up for the "challenge scene" because you would not let me. I posted for my Adren Challenge and I did not hear from my Tribal ST. I've logged in and tried to be a part of the game but, nothing. I am not saying that all of the inactivity in the game is because of you. Far from it. But, how can I change my opinion of you if you won't let me?
Gabby Girl (May 16, 2011 10:25:01 PM)
my post now?
GeoffH OOC (May 16, 2011 10:25:15 PM)
Yea yea yea... sorry, should have put (fin)
Gabby Girl (May 16, 2011 10:25:35 PM)
It is okay
Gabby Girl (May 16, 2011 10:32:09 PM)
I can not really lay the blame at any one persons feet, yes I tried my best to inform the team, through fpm. Yes I did create the fenris sept in maine and place it in the st section for a point of interst of more tribal based themes for the fenris game. Indeed I notified the head st as a narrator I was not allowed to do scenes that would reflect the venue as a whole without the head st approval. There was serious lack of communication durring the entire month of december. The team was incouraged to take a break for the entire month along with the head st. There is where my first mistake came in, for I thought leaving a venue with no sts for that long was not wise. So I decided as was my choice to continue running scenes during the month of december.
Gabby Girl (May 16, 2011 10:37:19 PM)
The scene you mention occured on Winter Soltice December 21st. Most might not celbrate that holiday but it seemed to be the only time the fenris as a group could get together before they headed off to family homes for the holidays. I should have made the wait till mid jan but I sacrafised my holiday to jump start the story line. As Far as the Captain goes I had his sheet but due to a st interaction and do, dont do, then a do, and one last change at the last minute saying don't do unless, which was the day before the challenge I was pretty much hands tied behind back and jack's appearence was inevidable in the end. I had planned on bringing him in before for the story line. Then I was told that the last elder was killed for a specific reason, but not till I had all ready had everything outlined was this reason even told to me.
Gabby Girl (May 16, 2011 10:40:18 PM)
Again it was a team issue as the entire team failed myself included, try as I might, and as they might no one was truly getting what was being done. There was as you say many issues on many different levels, some I had not only as a narr but as a player in the venue. Some like you say dealing with rules of combat. You think graples got convoluted (sp?) I am forever reminded about being shot with a shot gun and the st telling me I am dead cause it is silver damage. "I did not see you roll damage for the bullete though" To which the st responded. "I did not know i had to roll the damage I thought the gun just did automatic damage"
GeoffH OOC (May 16, 2011 10:41:28 PM)
I call that Shadowrun Syndrome.
Gabby Girl (May 16, 2011 10:44:20 PM)
As far as the you not being in the story lines It is not that I did not want you in them. All honesty I thought you where picking times in which others could not make it on purpose so that you can avoid them. I was not allowed to speak to you about any sort of conflicts or concearn I was told that was not my job and ghostlin the head st was the only one whom could deal with player concearns. Thus I could not approach you on the issue as a narrator. I did try to put more philiodox scenes in the fenris section where I specificly called for forsetti and tried to make them on your time line so you could make them without calling you out to keep from making any sort of waves that might come back as seen as harassing you in some fashion.
GeoffH OOC (May 16, 2011 10:47:56 PM)
My availabiliity never really changed. Days might shift here and there but, I have always been available late at night due to familial commitments. I do have one question about Jak and the SL but, want to preface it by saying, I don't want Bastian to be Tribal Alpha... I never did. I don't want to deal with the petty drama. But, why couldn't he lose that challenge? Why couldn't he just be a Adren Skald looking for aid from the Sept?
Gabby Girl (May 16, 2011 10:47:58 PM)
As for not running your rank challenge, I had asked the fenris to feel free to fpm me for scenes on repeated occasions. In fact in the hst meeting I just had the staff spoke of the best way to handle scene requests with the beta program and the request threads and my own method (which I am trying to correct) in which I ask people to fpm me because I check my fpms every day several times a day I find it quicker for me to respond to them. I normaly have scenes back to back for a entire week in advance because each day i am answering my fpms. Like you see you requested this talk it was met with responce the same evening.
Gabby Girl (May 16, 2011 10:49:42 PM)
with me
Gabby Girl (May 16, 2011 10:59:03 PM)
I did take your spirit compromise when you gave it to me as well. It was a good idea, and you fpmed me that idea and thus I took it and ran with it, it made sence. As for the challenge it was a challenge it was renown for all whom entered the challenge be it win or loose those who entered into it where allowed to claim renown for the honorable challenge. I have a hard time seeing gaining renown as a waste of peoples time, be it you win or loose you tried and you got something for it. As for the Skald looking for aid from the sept that was my backup plan, as for you not wanting to be a tribal alpha I think who ever does wind up as the tribal alpha will have there hands pretty full of all sorts of drama both petty and not so petty. I have seen these postions fall in the past into players hands and I have never seen them work for the benfit of a venue but be detrimental in it. With that said that is what I have seen, what I have witnessed first hand. The fenris venue currently is split down the middle on this. H
Gabby Girl (May 16, 2011 11:02:58 PM)
Half the players have sent me fpms asking me not to remove jack as the tribal alpha, I told them I have every intension of removing him and honoring our old hst promise to his players. Some have said they will delete there fenris pcs and just make another tribe or quit all together, that is there perogitive I will not break the promise made to those whom have worked so hard to achieve the ability to challenge. I have allready caught slack for honoring one of his other promises from one of the admins who said "It is your venue now you do not have to honor that promise!" But I refused to break the word of the old st, as such 3 pc's one being my very own which have been here since the begining and where not transfers but starting pcs all deleted our pcs.
GeoffH OOC (May 16, 2011 11:03:10 PM)
Well with the overpowered way that Jack entered the Challenge I don't think it really was a backup plan, do you? I mean was there any question that he would win when he had twice the soak dice of Lukas and Bastian?
Gabby Girl (May 16, 2011 11:04:42 PM)
I remember him getting 1 sux to soak and lukas failing his damage. I do remember lukas having more dex and brawl due to his numina then jack had to his soak.
Gabby Girl (May 16, 2011 11:05:29 PM)
I think if lukas got that hit in lukas would have been the tribal elder had he not failed his damage roll
GeoffH OOC (May 16, 2011 11:05:39 PM)
Numina can only be used for one roll in an entire scene.
Gabby Girl (May 16, 2011 11:08:35 PM)
(one sec)
GeoffH OOC (May 16, 2011 11:09:17 PM)
Also it cost a gnosis to do, so could not be used on a round that someone used Rage.
GeoffH OOC (May 16, 2011 11:10:19 PM)
I guess it is not per scene... it is per point of gnosis spent...
Gabby Girl (May 16, 2011 11:13:32 PM)
okay im back sorry bout that bathroom and then got a phone call telling me i needed to log on to accept a file from one of my staff members
GeoffH OOC (May 16, 2011 11:14:00 PM)
No worries.
Gabby Girl (May 16, 2011 11:16:31 PM)
Well as for the whole spending the gnosis on the numina I was pretty sure it could be used more then once I knew there was some stipulation but at that point as lukas was the second challenger and my night had pretty much been ruined and everyone was up in arms about the entirty of the scene I was not about to book hop I just at that point wanted it over with and thus did not nit pick on the gnosis rolls assuming lukas knew as it was his numina and I myself have only taken that background once in my entire online rping of wta.
GeoffH OOC (May 16, 2011 11:21:11 PM)
Well Jack was overpowered. There was no real chance of him losing that Challenge so it was just a rail road. Admittedly, we as players expected to be rail roaded about it. The only reason that Bastian did/would challenge for alpha is to make sure that there is a challenge. It's the Fenrir way. A leader can't just step up without someone challenging him. I didn't want the position, don't want it, hope to hell someone else goes for it. But, I also don't like the wool pulled out from under me. And concidering the BS I had endured previously, that scene was like a final straw. Did you get the brunt of my wrath, unearned? Sure. But, I got so mad when you would not just admit you had changed things mid-combat to correct some mistake you made. It infuriated me. It still makes me mad. Do you want to know why?
Gabby Girl (May 16, 2011 11:22:03 PM)
But that is long over with and happened back in december, I have been active I have not tried to exclude you or anyone else from my scenes, but as far as seeking out a reason or trying to confront you on it my hands where tied. I was not allowed to I was a narrator and not allowed to deal with player complaints or concearns on any level. That is no longer the case. As for soap box, I am constantly told to "Look at this" People send me "links" and then taunt me with what is being said to get me to open it up. I refuse to take advice from that place I refuse to read the stuff on those forums. If some one has a concearn or advice or some sort of issue I ask they contact me here on SI where I work. I have no affiliation with soap box or its forum base it is not a part of this chat, as a team member I am not even allowed to post to that place so I have been trying hard to ignore that place and will continue to ignore it in the future.
Gabby Girl (May 16, 2011 11:23:24 PM)
Please do tell me why, but I see it is obvious it is still burning at you.
GeoffH OOC (May 16, 2011 11:26:14 PM)
It's because I expected better. I Hoped that our new ST, who loves Fenrir, would be a great addition to the game. I had heard a few good things about you from others and I went in to that scene hoping that there was going to be a difference. Sure, I felt like it was going to be more of the same, but, deep down, I wanted that scene to be great. And when it was sooooooo bad, it really kind of broke my heart. "Just more of the same old SI, bullshit."
Gabby Girl (May 16, 2011 11:30:16 PM)
I am sorry I left you feeling that way. It was not my intent what so ever. I also was very disheartned I had wanted nothing more then to run a solid fenris game. I was eager to ask for them as a tribe, I had written up the stuff all with greatness in mind. I was told I could go ahead with it, but like many other things I questioned if they had even read what I had written up As it was not until I started speaking of the alpha to the other sts that i was even told they killed the old alpha was killed for a specific purpose. I did not agree with the purpose in which they had killed him for, and i pointed out how it could look and what it was. They pretty much told me to take one for the team and in ever single way I did and still am.
Gabby Girl (May 16, 2011 11:30:56 PM)
(That the old tribal alpha was killed for a specific pupose)
GeoffH OOC (May 16, 2011 11:31:39 PM)
Then why did you say that you had no clue that the Tribal Alpha was suppose to go to a PC when we had that meeting in January? If you knew in Decemember?
Gabby Girl (May 16, 2011 11:32:09 PM)
I told you I didnt know till the last minute
Gabby Girl (May 16, 2011 11:32:47 PM)
Which is pretty much the case I told them the resoning was well non ethical they told me if not there way then bring in the new elder.
GeoffH OOC (May 16, 2011 11:33:40 PM)
Okay but you said, you did not know that the old elder was killed to bring in a PC Alpha. In the meeting. Like it was fresh information in January. As if you found out 'after' you ran the scene.
Gabby Girl (May 16, 2011 11:33:56 PM)
so you got a new elder it was not easy to get ahold of them as they where all on break at the time it was litterly the day before that i thought it was going to be how they wanted then the day of it changed and thus in came the new elder in the midst of a freakin challenge at the last second when i was not prepared for it
Gabby Girl (May 16, 2011 11:34:32 PM)
I didnt till about the week before and the challenge had allready been schedualed by then
GeoffH OOC (May 16, 2011 11:34:54 PM)
Okay, they why did you have Jack challenge at all then?
GeoffH OOC (May 16, 2011 11:35:02 PM)
If you knew before the scene?
Gabby Girl (May 16, 2011 11:36:27 PM)
Listen im not gonna come out and say it cause its pointing to some major unethical st tatics that where completely wrong, so if it helps to blame me for it that is okay by me as I had agreed to take the blame for it and keep my mouth shut which I have done and continue to do even though it might make me look like a jack ass I had hoped with the work i have done since then and the effort i put into giving the players a good game they would see that im not the tyrant they orignaly thought.
Gabby Girl (May 16, 2011 11:37:35 PM)
I dont mind saying "its my fault yes I am the jackass, forgive me lets move foward" cause that is about as much as I can do.
GeoffH OOC (May 16, 2011 11:41:32 PM)
I don't want to blame you if you are not wrong. I want to move forward and enjoy the game. And your effort would change how I feel, if, I had been included at all. I mean, I really really want to enjoy the game. I want you to enjoy ST'ing. But, right now, It's your ethics that are in question. If there was some kind of favoritism, or something that you could not control, I would expect you to stand up against it. Now that you are the HST, I want to trust that you will. It's like what Del did by quitting over something she believed was unfair. If something wrong happens that is to the detriment of the game, I would like to think that you would stand up and cry foul, instead of roll over and take the blame.
Gabby Girl (May 16, 2011 11:47:57 PM)
I did explain it was unethical and my hands where tied, as a narrator my hands where truly tied. They are no longer tied and the challenge will be coming soon. There is nothing more to say on that matter. If you want any personal scenes or specific scenes run by me please send me a fpm in the future there is no way for me to miss fpms. I could not force you to join the scenes that i had posted I told everyone to try to post the avilabilies that the others had where avilable for so as many could make it as possidble. Some made 1 scene some made 2 few made all three scenes you and crom where the only fenris players whom where incapable of making any of the umbral scenes.
Gabby Girl (May 16, 2011 11:50:04 PM)
you made some of the meetings and the punishment ones, last time if I am not mistaken I asked your friend if he could reach you so that you could log on and join a scene. I mean it is not like I have not tried to include you in things but I seriously thought for a great while you just avioded my scenes because of how much you ditest me it is not like you have not been extremly vocal about these feelings.
GeoffH OOC (May 16, 2011 11:50:07 PM)
In one instance you specifically set the time on a day I could make in favor of Dastai, saying that 9PM on a Thursday was too late to start when people work on friday. But, two of the scenes were on Sundays that I could not make starting at 830 when people work on Monday.
GeoffH OOC (May 16, 2011 11:51:15 PM)
You informed him at the time of to call me. Rather than posting a scheduled time on the forums. What if I could not make it?
Gabby Girl (May 16, 2011 11:53:35 PM)
It had happened ic and I knew you had been wanting to deal with the issues around crom so I asked him if you where online and he called you. As for the above the first scene was the largest it had more then one major combat scene involved in it with a long story line which was allready written out on my part. The second was not by sea it only had the main battle and was not as complex or long as the first write up.
GeoffH OOC (May 16, 2011 11:54:32 PM)
I understand you were a Narrator. But, it kind of breaks my heart that you would knowing let some unethical things happen. I know if I was a Narrator and I saw something wrong happening I would voice it loudly. I would not work for a team like that.